lets get it right

Anything related to biodiesel/biofuels, questions, answers, technical information for all VW Diesel Engines should go here.

Moderator: Fatmobile

vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

lets get it right

Post by vano7 »

there is no need to covert your car with tanks heaters whatever you might need to modify your fuel filter only wvo it must be liquid clear oil no hydrodgenated oil blend right filter it right and you are clear to go i have 4 diesels runing on wvo with out a problem it is all about how you blend and clean the oil
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

I guess this topic should have been titled blend vs svo but your way sounds much more insulting ha like you know the right way ha and we are alll fools you probably don't even have a vac gauge i go to mpls 300milesroundtrip it only takes a cup of diesel but the right way takes gallons wow your a genious a genious that won't even make it through winter one no punctuation runon sentence makes it hard to read not much effort put into your post or system so don't expect much effort on a response i predict you won't make it through the winter many people don't use a vacuum gauge and think everything is running fine they don't know fools learn the hard way
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

i did not come in to insult anyone

Post by vano7 »

first off iam not a english major second off maybe you should investigate before you talk out of hand third off i pick the brains of world war 2 vets it is there system i use just for your info i just got back from a 600 hundred mile trip on 11 gallons blended fuel thats a little over 52 miles a gallon 98 jetta tdi i now have over 12000 miles on blended fuel that is not counting the four mercedes benz 300 that are running on the same fuel just trying to make it simple it was 18 above zero where i live the other day and my little 98 jetta tdi with 200000 miles fired right up with no 2 tank no heated fuel lines just little old bosh glow plugs remember the world war 2 boys were doing this way before you the only advantage they had was multy fuel veicals they still have them today and they did not have a choice
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

You don't have to be an english major to put a period at the end of a sentence and capitalise the next letter, put a comma where you pause... your writing style is just lazy.... like the people that read it aren't worth your time,... or effort.... (I see a theme). Hit return every once in awhile to break it up so it's not just a blob of words.

Of course you got 52mpg with a TDI Jetta. How much diesel did you use per mile?,... isn't that the goal,... use less diesel? It's like you are pointlessly bragging.
If you want to bragg, make a point; (bragg>)I can make that 600 mile trip on 2 cups of diesel, a gallon at the most, (make point>)your system can't do that,... so what makes your system the right way?
remember the world war 2 boys were doing this way before you
Is that what makes it the right way? You know the right way because you picked the brain of someone who was doing "this" longer than me?
That all you got?

Starting at 18F makes it the right way? Ok, that was the low for the night probably not the temp when you started it. Very few cars on here won't start at 18F and I suppose it takes little effort to use more diesel in the mix,... if using less diesel isn't your goal.

You obviously know very little about systems other than your own,... the WWII guys must not have told you, so I'm going to throw this back at ya:
you should investigate before you talk out of hand
I figure if you had put forth enough effort to install a vacuum gauge you would have said so but you avoided the topic. Probably didn't even put forth enough effort to install a clear piece of fuel line before the pump and I concider that to be the very least you can do to monitor the situation.

You are obviously coming on here starting a post stating that your system is better than anyone elses,... it's the right way. Sounds like it's the right way because you put forth little effort to build it.... if there is something else that makes your system the right way let us know,... please try to do it without pointless bragging and talking down to us,... it's insulting.
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

Post by vano7 »

1 no my system can not make it on 2 cups of diesel because i do not use diesel
2 so far it seems you are the one bragging about 2 cups of diesel
3 you forgot to mention the second tank the heaters the switches the extra fuel line the extra filters the piping of the radaitor into the svo tank so you can heat the svo and do you even know if your oil is warming evenly it takes alot more than 10 minutes to heat oil the way you are doing it and to bring it all to the same temp
4 well vacuum gauge and we need that for what, i have not changed anything in the system except for the fuel and there is no diesel in it
5 why do you keep saying iam using diesel, when i never said i was,I said I was blending oil
6 clear fuel line well the jetta is built with a clear fuel line, so are the mercedes DA whats up with that
7 the world war 2 boys new more than you will ever know sorry you never thougt enough to learn from experiance
8 no diesel is the goal
9 you seem to like bragging and insulting instead of conversing you keep trying to reinvent the wheel
10 you keep saying make a point. well my point is there are simpler ways of doing this so you keep spending your money on all those extra parts and keep building those two tank systems and keep the economy going
11 as far as system go your system uses diesel mind does not
12 I tryed to make this simple for you to read
Pu241
Cetane Booster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2007 6:24 pm
Location: Bridgeport, OH

Post by Pu241 »

I have to agree with you Vano7 you most definitely are no english major!

So enough BS!

You going to let us in on your little blending secret or just make more noise and waste bandwidth!

I for one 'am willing to work through your use of the english lanuage if you have something more useful to say than what you've written above.

Otherwise, I have better things to do!

One point that really must be corrected, the use of "world war 2 boys".
If you were there, you have the right to use that term!
You were not, so a term of respect should be used; the "men of War II"
is a suggestion.
All problems can be solved with the appropriate application of antimatter!
'81 Rabbit 125K
'88 GMC Step Van P-30 6.2L
Detroit Diesel 2-71 Generator
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

Thanks for changing your format.
It was much easier to read.
... but still not worth the time it took.
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

3 you forgot to mention the second tank the heaters the switches the extra fuel line the extra filters the piping of the radaitor into the svo tank so you can heat the svo and do you even know if your oil is warming evenly it takes alot more than 10 minutes to heat oil the way you are doing it and to bring it all to the same temp
I have mentioned those things. The www link at the bottom of my page lists all that, as well as many posts on this fora. Did you want me to repeat it all for you? I put forth the effort to write it once, now all you have to do is put forth the effort to read it. Repeating it for you would be a waste of my time.

#1, #2, #5, #8, #11
Since you are using gasoline or used motor oil or something else you are asshamed to mention,... how about we change the goal to using less fossil fuels?
I did bragg about using 2 cups of diesel to go 600 miles, but you missed the point. It wasn't pointless braging like you; about getting 52 mpg,... everyone driving a TDI should get that, it's normal and has nothing to do with your setup being the right way. See I was comparing my setup to yours, not pointlessly bragging like you continue to do. I should have said fossil fuels.... that might have given you less pointless crap to discuss.
5 why do you keep saying iam using diesel, when i never said i was,I said I was blending oil
You haven't said what you blend it with. I figure having something that you think everyone else want makes you feel powerful and in control. Maybe you have another reason for stateing that your sytem is the right way, then not describing it. What ever your reason, you've had plenty of opportunity to discuss it but haven't.

#3 again, #4, #6, #10
Yes, as I suggested earlier; You think your system is the best because you put little effort into it,... you have no idea what to monitor or how to monitor but it starts and seems to be running right. Bliss on!
Thanks for having the courage to admit you have no vacuum gauge, don't even know what it's for and aren't willing to put forth the effort to do a search and find out.
That line isn't clear anymore is it, so what if it was clear when the factory installed it? Moot point, you don't know why it should be clear anyway.... bliss and drive.

...and that leaves #7
7 the world war 2 boys new more than you will ever know sorry you never thougt enough to learn from experiance
That is about the dumbest thing I've heard in a long time.... are you drunk? More than I will ever know? About everything? I don't learn from experience? I think you should stop using the men of WWII to justify your system. It comes off like you are bragging about something someone else did.... trying to make them sound like know-it-alls that no one can compare to. Trying to make yourself sound smart because you hang with them, and trying to make others feel dumb because they don't get their info from the same source. I think you ruin their good name.
It's a fools arguement.... and the sarcastis "sorry" makes you sound like a vally girl.... how old are you? I feel like I'm talking to a 10 year old.
NEWS FLASH: many technological advancements had nothing to do with WWII vets, and many people who come up with their own ideas are just as smart or smarter than most of the WWII vets.
Sounds like you are hanging around some smart people,.. I truely hope it rubs off some day.

Ooops forgot to address #9. Why reinvent it,... but the world has always tried to improve the wheel and continues to. It doesn't sound like you are even trying to improve it so you just keep blissing along on wooden wheels and claim it's the right way.... because it's easy.
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

blended liquid clear oil

Post by vano7 »

1 seems to me thats all you do is waste your time
2 45 gal clear oil 4.5 gal kerosine 2.5 gal unleaded gas 33 oz ocetatine
5 oz murrys oil 5.3 oz cncentrated water dispersant
3 my system is 7 55 gal tanks 3 on the left storage 1 steel tank in the center 3 on the right 2 2500 wat water heaters installed in steel tank 1 centerfuge mounted on steel tank all barrels are pipe top and bottom to a 5 gal a minute oil pump i took off one of my fryers

6 I filter the oil in a 100 mic 5 gal bucket filter first then pour it in the storage barrel
7 pump the oil to the top of steel barrel where it goes through a 55 gal 100 mic filter
8 turn the heaters on bring oil up to 160 to 180 temp
9 start the centrifuge 50 gal and hour it will clean
10 cycle the oil until it is clean
11 when it is clean move the oil to the right side of the system
12 pour in the the mix and turn on the pump at 5 gal a minute on the pump it only takes a few minutes to mix
13 from the mixing barrels i pump it threw 1 5 mic filter 1 diesel filter 1 diesel water filter and into the car
14 depending on how dirty the oil is it could take more than 3 passes threw the centrifuge
15 lets just say iam on the back side of 50 started when i was 9 years old in my buddys dads garage on joy road in detroit on weekends been self employed for 35 years own a full service resturant for the last 14 years in northern mich lic builder for28 years brick mason by trade havac repair plumbing electrical carpentry no I am not bragging just telling what you want to know
16 looking for guys who want to help improve not run your mouth and continuly insult sorry i thought you new about blending oil this is not about fossil fuel this about the dollar you been hangen out with all gore and hillary to long


5 diesels running on this fuel
soon to start working 45kw diesel generator to power the hole place

pu241 i hope this helps you out you got any ideas on how to improve
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

1 seems to me thats all you do is waste your time
Nice little insulting jab to start off with. Made me laugh :lol: when I concidered who was saying it.
I was starting to think my time was being wasted too but you finally got on topic.
Sounds like you have put more work in your garage than I have in my car... You have put forth some effort.
I see why the goal is to use less diesel,.. because a goal of less fossil fuels doesn't fit the bill. Actually, as far as using diesel goes, I concider kerosine to be the same thing as ULSD,... very little difference.... so I do use less diesel than you.
16 looking for guys who want to help improve not run your mouth and continuly insult sorry i thought you new about blending oil this is not about fossil fuel this about the dollar you been hangen out with all gore and hillary to long

Oh, and you were doing so well,... until you started running your mouth. I understand,... hard to work with people that are too much like you.
All about the money, don't care about the trade deficit and what that does to our country? You don't care about being reliant on other countries for our energy? I'm not surprised it's all about you and your pocketbook. You are also a poor judge of character, you don't understand me at all. I don't hang with hillary and don't believe we effect global warming, I think the sun is getting hotter and sunspots have a much greater effect on the temp of the planet than we do.... my reasons for converting my cars are economic but I care less about what's in my pocket right now, I'd like to see a strong country with a strong economy,... for everyone. I also don't like giving money to oil barons... but that's not because I'm greedy, I just don't like them.

If it's about the dollar,... your system isn't the right way,... mine is cheaper to operate (might sound like a bragg to you but I am actually making the same point as before).. ...and even though you are proud of how little you had to do to,... if we stood side by side and someone handed us each 5 gallons of oil. I would drive away in 5 minutes because I did my work ahead of time,... if it was dirty oil, it might take me 1/2 hour and some 12 volt power.... how long would it take you?
Your system isn't as simple as you made it seem, and takes up way more room. About as much trouble as making biodiesel.... the setup in your car it too simple to make it through very cold weather,... summer is easy and that's all you have under your belt so far. I'm guessing your blend will change and get more expensive this winter, might even leave you beside the road... we'll see. I don't expect you to report back if it does. :lol: [/quote]
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

I must admit that you are right about me being insulting in this post... but if you check around I don't think you'll find me treating other people like this,... and I don't think you will find anyone else on here that's been as rude and arrogant as you.
We got what we gave.... but I hope we can change our attitudes and get along starting now.
Have you figured out why you need a vacuum gauge and/or clear fuel line yet?
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

Post by vano7 »

1 my line is still clear and i can see what the fuel is doing
2 you know ,your monitoring your fuel with a clear line and vac gauge thats not a tough thing to figure out
3 I dont recall insulting you or your grammer witch is not perfect
4 well i can still use my trunk
5 as far as my time i am still very quick at what i do
6 we would all like to see a good economy
7 i dont't think i am a poor judge of character you seem to be hung up on the word right ,proud,bragging, can you converse with out the attatude
8 when that guy gives us the 5 gal i am going to give you my 5 and open the trunk get 5 out and poor it in and begone
9 how many filters you go through with svo how long does it take to heat the oil in winter conditions before you can switch over
10 do you even filter the oil before you put it in the tank
11 how many lines have you clapsed before you figured out you needed a stronger fuel line
12 what is your milage with a full tank of diesel and a full tank of svo onboard
13 look when i started out i used the there system of filters and it does not work filters alone will just clog up so i make sure the oil is as clean as i can get it before i blend it it seems to be working just fine i am going to do a freeze test on it to find out the jell point and from there i will try to ajust the mix as far as the size of my still i use alot of oil i also have a fuel oil boiler that i am putting in the resturant to heat the building i will have it complete in the next month
14 2 weeks ago i sent 5 young guys off to kentucky in a 240d they had 17 in the tank 40 in the trunk it cost them 10 dollars apiece they still had room in the trunk for all there close they made it there and back from there meeting so you know my system is not to big because i always try to keep at least 100 gal ready to go
15 i don't think i put more work in the garage then you put in your car
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

jell point

Post by vano7 »

tested 4 oz of blend jell point is 10 deg above going to ajust blend try to get below 0 deg
Fatmobile
Global Moderator
Posts: 7564
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:28 pm
Location: north central Iowa

Post by Fatmobile »

8 when that guy gives us the 5 gal i am going to give you my 5 and open the trunk get 5 out and poor it in and begone
I think anyone can see that as you being unable to admit you would lose that contest,... so you changed the rules. Basically admiting that it takes you longer to get on the road once given the raw materials.
2 you know ,your monitoring your fuel with a clear line and vac gauge thats not a tough thing to figure out
4 well vacuum gauge and we need that for what
4 well i can still use my trunk
So can I. Plenty of room when I'm using the 6 gallon marine tank. When I put an extra 10 gallon filter setup in the Rabbit it takes up some room,... but that's only when I'm on the road.
7 i dont't think i am a poor judge of character you seem to be hung up on the word right ,proud,bragging, can you converse with out the attatude
I think you are a poor judge of your own character. You can't even see your own pointless bragging, instead of comparing systems and a know-it-all, my system is the right system and everyone elses isn't attitude.
9 how many filters you go through with svo how long does it take to heat the oil in winter conditions before you can switch over
Good question. In the winter I need to drive about 7 miles before I can switch to vegy,... if it's below 32F.
I don't go through filters.... maybe one stock Rabbit filter a year. Regardless if it needs it or not. I use a filter backflush setup that cleans the filter on shutdown.
10 do you even filter the oil before you put it in the tank
Not usually, the eatery has a filter that goes down to 30 microns cold filtered, I just pour until I see the settled creamyness and that goes in a different jug that goes back to their grease dumpster.
11 how many lines have you clapsed before you figured out you needed a stronger fuel line
Melted my first poly one and got pulled home by the neighbor kids. Collapsed a piece of PEX when I wasn't watching my vacuum gauge after switchover this spring. It didn't leak, just collapsed.
I didn't conclude I needed a stronger fuel line. I blame it on not having a warning beeper hooked up to a vacuum switch.... and not watching the gauge. I never should have let it pull that hard. It got to 20" hg.
... so that's twice,... in over 6 years, much experimenting.
12 what is your milage with a full tank of diesel and a full tank of svo onboard
My old Fatmobile is worn out, with compression close to 325 on all cylinders,... it's hard to tell. The vegy tank is close to 6 gallons but I don't measure the amount of fuel. Probably close to 45mpg.
13 look when i started out i used the there system of filters and it does not work filters alone will just clog up so i make sure the oil is as clean as i can get it before i blend it it seems to be working just fine i am going to do a freeze test on it to find out the jell point and from there i will try to ajust the mix as far as the size of my still i use alot of oil i also have a fuel oil boiler that i am putting in the resturant to heat the building i will have it complete in the next month
Yeah, best to let it settle first. I use my used oil filters to prefilter so they are free.
Just in time for the cold weather.
14 2 weeks ago i sent 5 young guys off to kentucky in a 240d they had 17 in the tank 40 in the trunk it cost them 10 dollars apiece they still had room in the trunk for all there close they made it there and back from there meeting so you know my system is not to big because i always try to keep at least 100 gal ready to go
From what I read of your blend. It is about 10% kerosine,.. 1/7th fossil fuels total (summer blend). 57 gallons total with about 5.7 gallons of kero at about $5 a gallon,... that's over $20 there,.. + about 3 gals gas and about 40 oz of "ocetatine". Did they come home with a bunch of fuel or did I figure that wrong? How many miles?

You know I could do it cheaper right? Since I don't use any fossil fuels when I'm going down the road. and fuel prep takes less time. So I still wonder what makes you think yours is the right way. Cost more and requires more work to prep the fuel.
15 i don't think i put more work in the garage then you put in your car

Maybe not, it's hard to tell.... I still had to build a filter so it's not just the car so maybe.
'91 Golf gasser converted to a 12mm pump, M-TDI.
'84 1.6TD Rabbit with a VNT-15 turbo, still setup to run on vegetable oil.
'84 GTI with 1.7TD pistons and intercooled.
2003 TDI wagon
2000 TDI Jetta.
vano7
Cetane Booster
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:11 am
Location: mich

where did you wright the rules

Post by vano7 »

1 i did not see any rules in your chalange
2 iam not looking to be competitive just have a little fun at what iam doing and try to get it right, oops there goes that world again, but listen if you want to get competitive, give me a little time i will build and onboard system thats neat and clean, and will go for it, but please spell out the rules first so we can both agree.
3 vacoum gauge , more wasted parts i can feel when a filter is starting to clog. I can also still see threw the factory clear lines. when i first started out i was filtering through filters like the ones you are using had no luck with that type of filtering,and yes went through alot of filters, but now that iam using a centerfuge and geting the oil as close to clean as i can so far no more filter problems. I believe you are using more filters than your telling me about , and what if there is water in it, I dont see any setup for water on your filtering system.
4 okay you say your using a 6 gal tank, lets say you get 45mph that is 270 miles and you have to stop. I think its a 12 gal tank not sure but I will check, 12gal @ 45miles a gal is 540 miles how you gonna know if iam abiding by the rules, your a couple hours behind me. ore you could just flip the switch to diesel, and try to hang in there. better yet we both stop when you run out, and then we grab the fuel from this guy and you start cleaning it, in the mean time i still have 270 left in the tank, so i will put it in the onboard filtering system and drive off while you are trying to get the junk out of it. whataya tink.
5 get off the poor judge of character, your not telling the whole story on how many hours you have in that whole job or how many filters you are using to clean that oil, on the road you are not going to find any body to filter the oil to 30 mic for you, and truthfully I have never seen a cold system in a resturant that could filter cold oil, so please inlighten me on this resturant cold filtering system
6 how many miles did you put on the fatmobile on svo, how many on it when tou started to use svo
7 when we discuss cost , lets discuss all the cost. Cost to modify your car truck what ever. now if you wanted to put your fuel in another vechile can you do so. no we have to convert the vechile first .and then we have to make sure the conversion is done right oops theres that word again. so more time ,more parts. but you can use the same filtering system. there you go we just saved a few bucks I never said the system iam using is the one and only right one. dam there goes that word again. but when I back up the 5 vehicles to the pump, so far i have not had to convert them.
As far as the work goes, I went to the store in the morning, bought some vavles,hose.and a few clamps, only because i did not have enough stough in my junk pile, came back to the man cave ,by 5 oc i was drinking a beer and trying to blend fuel, well within the first month i figured out the filter system was not going to do job, so i searched for something better, fond a centerfuge. so ad another 3 hrs time. so far it does a great job, no filter cloging on the vehicle, change the oil in the cars every 3500 miles, they are running good, they sound good, no strange noises
8 seeing that you are so well versed in the jetta think about this, new turbo installed, runs great when cold, turbo runs intermititly when warm, what the hell is up with that, I have not really investagated turbos,so iam going to start looking for what makes it tick.
Post Reply