Looking for advice from experience..

[ZachDKingNH]

hey everyone, i was just hoping to get a bit of advice from everyone on a car ive been looking to purchase. Im 17 years old and have a bit of mechanical experience but im looking to get more and hopefully this would be a good way. It's an 81 4 door rabbit with a 84 jetta turbo diesel and a 5 speed transmission. The transmission is suppose to be perfect the engine needs a new head gasket and just to have the head cleaned. The head is currently off. It also has typical floor rust, but the shock towers and frame are in solid condition. The vehicle has 180 k on it a fresh rebuild with 15 k. It's a real turbo motor with piston oilers. Not just a converted diesel. The seller is asking $695. I feel like its a pretty reasonable price. And i would really enjoy tinkering and learning. Any advice?

[82vdub]

Welcome to the forum and there's a lot of knowledge here.

First, I think $695 is a pretty good price for the car, especially if the turbo is not shot. That's my opinion, but I've seen just 1.6L turbo setups listed for more than this price online.

How do you know the head just needs to be cleaned to be reused? Since the head is off, you can check the cylinders for wear and taper, which should give you some idea on how bad the shortblock is - especially since it was rebuilt 15k ago. Keep in mind that "rebuilt" means all different ideas to all sorts of people, so it may just have had new gaskets put in it and it's "rebuilt". Why is the head off and what caused the issue for this? If it was overheated, the head/deck may be warped slightly and the temper out of the rings, leading to the engine using oil.

5 speed transmissions have the 5th gear (overdriven gear) up high and are really susceptable to damage when the oil in the trans runs low. If it were me, I'd almost assume that 5th has heat damage to it until it's proven otherwise. It may be drivable with or without issues, but something to consider.

If it were me, I'd be quite interested but want to know a little more on why the head needed to come off, especially if you want to get it running for cheap.

[ZachDKingNH]

hey thanks a bunch ill be sure to do a little investigating

[VW cat]

I think you got excellent advice there. Yes it would really be helpful if you knew why the head was removed.

Really when you think about the price, the car is a wreck in the eyes of most people. Try a $200 offer. Most visible rust is twice as bad as it appears.

Think about the cost of a safety check. I'm not sure what it's called in the U.S. It will probably take $1000 to get it on the road if you do the work yourself.

Consider that the Rabbit is the most simple and economical car out there, fun to drive, and at your age you'll have a ball. Good luck, Phil

[ZachDKingNH]

this is what the previous owner said was the reason for the head coming off. " when I hit something in the road and it kicked up into the radiator I saw steam and shut it down instantly. I was not under hard boost, so I did not have to cycle the motor to let the turbo cool down..." not really sure what that means, but when he rebuilt it he, put in new rings, rod bearings, and main bearings, the turbo was redone with new bearings and seals, new clutch, and throw out bearing and disk and pressure plate. Thank you all for all the advice so far.

[ZachDKingNH]

this is what the previous owner said was the reason for the head coming off. " when I hit something in the road and it kicked up into the radiator I saw steam and shut it down instantly. I was not under hard boost, so I did not have to cycle the motor to let the turbo cool down..." not really sure what that means, but when he rebuilt it he, put in new rings, rod bearings, and main bearings, the turbo was redone with new bearings and seals, new clutch, and throw out bearing and disk and pressure plate. Thank you all for all the advice so far.

[82vdub]

Would you pull the head(s) off a motor if you saw steam coming out from under the hood? I think the previous owner isn't telling you that he overheated the engine or was running too much boost where he blew out the head gasket. The head's off for some reason, and it's not from "instantly shutting the engine down upon seeing steem" either. In either case, I would assume the head needs work and that the block/head surface may be warped until you prove for yourself that it isn't.

[ZachDKingNH]

when i go to look at it how will i be able to tell if the head is dammaged or warped?

[82vdub]

You can't tell by looking at it. You'll need a straitedge and I believe the maximum warpage is around 5-7 thousandths of an inch (.005").

[ZachDKingNH]

will a metal straight edge ruler do? and should i lay it going parallel with the head, or perpendicular? thanks

[82vdub]

Not sure exactly what you mean by a metal straight edge ruler, but if it's what I think it is, you need to get a certified straight edge to do this task. If you use something that's not straight, checking straightness to a non-straight device isn't going to give real answers. Snap On (and others) makes straight edges. Here's what I'm talking about: http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp ... p_ID=17363

I would check for straightness in every dimension you can: long ways, short ways, and corners to corners.

[VW cat]

Sounds like he did most of the work himself on that engine, if so he would knowledgeable enough not to have pulled the cylinder head off without good reason.

Always assume the worst and the good news comes as a bonus.

I think I would replace the piston rings too, if I suspected overheating.

Take a look at the cylinder sealing rings built into the head gasket. Any sign of leakage shows up as a black area.

I have a rule for checking cylinder heads. It's big and heavy, no markings on it. Sometimes for a very quick check I use my carpenter square which is quite true over a short distance. If a piece of paper slides under it(about .003"), I take a closer look, that's checking the head at right angles between the cylinders. I've had several heads machined with no problems.

Personally I would be more concerned with the rust. A good body is worth picking up regardless of engine problems. Phil

[Fatmobile]

I'd guess it was overheated.
Pull the tube off the turbo intake and see how it spins.
Take a look at the cracks between the valves.
If it was seriously overheated, it can make cracks that are too wide.

[hagar]

Looking for advice from experience..


17 ? I am 77 so you are on the right track. . My two bits ? Relax go slow . You sound like you got "Gold Fever" . Is the seller a nice person ? if so put down $ 20.00 and get first refusal.

If it was here ? I would give you the Rabbit for Free , with a rider "NOT to be sold for 5 years".

You would be surprised if you found out , how many of us OLD GEEZERS , do not care about the money . These little wonders are way more than a Car , transportation or a way to save money..

The VW "BUG" started a "CULTURE" read my lips.. Just like the Ford model "T" did before it , or the Indian and the Harley ? EH. you bet.

hagar.

PS : so what do we Oldies want ? we want your generation to do something , to make a better world , NOT bigger Gangs. (better world ? , yes that can be fun too). lover the carbon foot print ? EH ?

[Golf/Jetta]

if i were 17 again, i would find a donor car that runs and rebuild one engine and go slow on it while i blow up the other one up, cause i just know i'm going to screw something up the first time.

first advise "if they haven't worked on diesel's, don't let your dad mom sis bro friend touch it... and get a bentley if you already done so.. replies take time.
check and double check and triple check everything concerning the engine area.. i've timed a diesel so many times, its funny.

first time i eyed the cam lobs dead on with the book (too much silicon/ engine died)... secound time i let my dad do it (vavle meets piston/engine blew up) then i learnt about the timing slot on the side of the cam (geez) the next engine (engine 3) didn't do anything to it.. after that engine(sold off) i did my first injection pump rebuild still a working progress cracked the head (over tighten injector/crack) (enigne 4). next engine (my first 1.9) new Tbelt, tentioner, water pump, T-stat (haven't put in yet), belt went between inter. pully and block, bent two valves and learnt hydrolic lifters needs replacment after 100K km.

so far i completed timing, rebuild the head (except valve sleeves), brakes, IP rebuild (working on it, haven't tested it yet. it does spit but brake the injectors¿?), injectors, suspension, engine/tranny, swapping, tire's, rads, somewhat air conditioning, bearings, ball joints, tie rods, axels, all in 8 years time and i'm thinkin of another diesel

to time an enigine takes 10m deep socket(valve cover), 13m(tentioner), 19m (cam), two 3m allen keys(tentioner), punch and hammer(take off cam pully) a 11m deep socket (hold IP), flat head screw driver (turn flywheel)
camshaft pulley repair tool(don't think thats the name), torque wrench (capable of 15ftlbs - 170 ftlbs, maybe two) and a thick enough metal plate to slide in the cam timing slot. 22ftlbs on the tensioner bolt and 33ftlbs on the, vavle cover i think its 10 or 15ftlbs (not much). belt should be somewhat tight snug fit.

second last time i timed my car i just started it.. but last time i turn over the engine by hand, used the starter to turn over, checked everything then waited 30 min for the new hydrolic lifter to set and the hole day to bleed down..

over several years i take great pride in my engine(s) (not car/rust bucket)
soon i'll find if the injection pump works or not, and get a replacment head for the cracked engine head, let alone the other eninge sitting on the side solid lifters...