Fuel Price Spread-- RUG to Diesel

[texcl]

I'm pretty sure it is just a traffic ticket here in ND I've heard it runs $250 they don't check tanks here very often. Now MN is another story, they set up check points and everything and if you get stopped you will get dipped, I've heard the fine is in the thousands in MN to boot. My commute takes me to MN so not worth the risk. I have though about making biodiesel but it looks like a lot of work.

[vanbcguy]

The funny thing is up here in Canada, the price of ULSD is often cheaper than RUG. It doesn't fluctuate as much so once in a while RUG will dip lower for a short while, but generally speaking they're either the same or diesel is slightly less. Often only 2-5% less, but still....

There's a few truck stops around which have excellent cash prices here. Often ~ 10% less than any other diesel I can find around. These days too quite a few stations are installing diesel pumps so that is causing more competition. At least half of the new Jettas I see around are TDIs these days.

Still, pays to keep your eyes open. There are a few stations around that are consistently 15% more expensive for the same fuel. I don't know if they feel they have a monopoly or something, but with a vehicle that can go practically forever without filling up I certainly don't need to panic and duck in there!

[vwtyp133]

Marketing 101 principles: #1 - “Supply & Demand”, but often over-ridden by … #2 - “Whatever the ‘traffic’ will bear.”

The retailers who consider that carrying diesel is a ‘favor’ to consumers frequently make around 3X the profit per diesel gallon, as compared to gasoline, according to some of their staff members. Seems as though it is the above-mentioned sense of not needing to be competitive in diesel fuel’s pricing, that allows ‘gouging’ to become the rule, rather than the exception.

BTW …though they may be a bit 'questionable' at times, here are the official gov’t price survey result sites.
U.S. EIA Gasoline and Diesel Fuel Update http://www.eia.gov/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp
U.S. EIA Weekly Retail On-Highway Diesel Prices http://www.eia.gov/oog/info/wohdp/diesel.asp
U.S. EIA Weekly U.S. Retail Gasoline Prices, Regular Grade http://www.eia.gov/oil_gas/petroleum/da ... _page.html

Of course, http://gasbuddy.com/ can sometimes help spot local pricing trends, and for us it seems more thorough than some of the other online trackers.

[texcl]

Yup, when I used to be a Border Patrol Agent on the southern border, the gas companies would raise the price of diesel in Mexico until the truck drivers would riot, they would take over the POE (yeah I know shouldn't they take over their own POE) and we would be sent in to kick them all out and re-take the installation. I know diesel prices would drop after that, you won't see that in the US. I assume diesel in Mexico is still cheap.

[vanbcguy]

Weird... So it's cheap in Mexico, and it's mostly cheaper in Canada, but expensive in the US compared to gasoline?

CAD / USD conversion time... Today I saw diesel at $1.379/L in Vancouver. It's expensive right now as it's winter diesel and it's heating oil season. We also have probably the most expensive fuel in Canada. That comes to... $1.379 x 3.78 = $5.21 CAD/US Gallon. In 'merican that'd be 'bout $5.04 USD/US Gallon as of today, but that's been pretty variable lately...

Right now regular gasoline in Vancouver is cheap compared to diesel - doesn't happen that often, but does once in a while especially at this time of year. Gas is at $1.279/L right now, or $4.72 CAD/US Gallon. So gas is about 10% less at the moment, probably the biggest spread on the 'positive' side for gasoline that I've seen in a year or so, if not more. PS... That'd be $4.57 USD/US Gallon...

What are the prices where you all are?

[texcl]

Ouch I thought we had it bad. We are at $4.12 for #2 and $4.43 for #1 gas is $3.32.

[vwtyp133]

... What are the prices where you all are?

Cheapest diesel here in SoCal's "Inland Empire" on http://gasbuddy.com/ right now looks to be $ 4.07/US gallon. Filled up one of our gasser cars tonight with regular grade @ $ 3.579/US gallon. Prices definitely rise going toward L.A. (which, oddly, has oil wells and refineries!)

ARCO (BP) is typically the least expensive of the major brands around here, and checking that same site, it appears that, other than right at the border, N/W Washington prices (Ferndale) are about the same as ours. That site, reporting for Vancouver, and even south in Surrey or east in Mission, lists the cheapest diesel price @ $ 1.329/L. Of course, it's all scalping; i.e. Calgary shows to have $ 0.82/L diesel and $ 0.979/L for regular gasoline! I've heard all the 'reasons'/excuses for differential geographic pricing (from friends & relatives who work for the oil companies/refiners/marketers), but... it's greed.

Slightly OT, re. fuel quality: I hesitate to run the 'unknown' brands in our gassers, but any diesel fuel seems to work about the same, especially with adding a bit of Power Service additive or ATF to each tankful. I do try to avoid stations that don't appear to sell much diesel; their tanks will accumulate more condensed water vapor, which they pump & sell right along with the diesel fuel. No Perrier for my VW, thanks.

[TylerDurden]

Three weeks ago, I filled-up at at recently built station. I may have been the first customer to buy diesel there.

The Jetta ran poorly after that, so I put PS in the tank and two cans of Diesel Purge through the IP. Tweeked the timing too.

Went from 47mpg down to 40mpg. Might be time for new nozzles.

Anyone get different mileage with winterized fuel?

[the man 53]

I usually get at least 4mpg less on winter diesel.

[82vdub]

Winter fuel will reduce your fuel mileage. It has to do with less cetane (diesel equivalent to octane) in the fuel after they add the additive.

[texcl]

Not to mention the cold itself adversely affects mileage. My tdi beetle gets between 43-46 in the warm months and 38-40 in the cold.

[TylerDurden]

Thanx for the replies regarding winterized fuel & cold weather.

My Westy never seems to change, but the Jetta economy just dropped like a rock (had it stored last winter).

[avocado]

As an aside, you can also consider the spread on an energy content basis.

To wit, the energy content of the fuels are roughly:
Gasoline: 115,000 British Thermal Unit (Btu) per U.S. gallon
Diesel: 131,000 Btu per U.S. gallon
Crude Oil: 138,100 Btu per U.S. gallon

Diesel has 14% more energy than gasoline on a volumetric basis. Therefore I generally feel ok if diesel is within 14% of the volumetric price of gasoline: or at least like I'm not getting screwed.

When you start using this for your MPG calculations, it gets even more interesting. This also carries over to greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions because the life cycle GHG emissions profiles of both fuels are *roughly* the same (97 to 99 kg CO2-equivalents per million Btu), so if you're using less fuel per mile on an energy (instead of volumetric) basis, you're producing less GHG emissions per mile.

[Harry]

Yep, Btu-wise diesel is about 14% greater content than gasoline.

But here, in the general Albuquerque area and surrounds, the lowest diesel price was $2.72/gal and the lowest diesel was $3.71/gal today. This diesel costing 35% more per gallon than regular gas per gallon. My 83 Q-Td gets about 45mpg, my wife's 86 Golf gasser gets about 32mpg. So the Q-TD gets about 40% better mileage than the gas Golf. If nothing breaks, maybe I'm about 5% better on the money than her Golf. The stations have been holding this price differential, percentage-wise for a couple of months now. It's rigged, here, at least.