have mercy, I added way too much oil and maybe broke it.

[Intharbuddy]

alright.so let me start by saying this is really really stupid but hopefully by fessing up to it you all might help me figure out how to get this thing back on the road.

I got another 85 1.6 diesel golf to replace the one that got smashed last winter. It needed a head so since I had the original one rebuilt not too long ago I got a friend to help install it into the new golf.
long story long,a few days after we got it on I finally got a chance to fill the fluids and put in fresh battery to see if it might run for me. okay here's the part where I'm an idiot. When checking the oil level I was having a really hard time seeing the level cuz the oil was so clear and it was starting to get a little dark in the woods behind my place where I had been working on it. I never had drained the oil but i wasn't seeing any black stuff so I assumed it was just the fresh stuff i was putting in it. Now, I'm mostly positive that there was a fair amount of fresh oil already in the pan and i more or less doubled it thinking that since i didn't see and black stuff the 4 or so quarts i had put in was good.

so i get it running and at idle everything is smooth once the black smoke works itself out. I'm stoked to be hearing a vw diesel that I own running again. Then about half a dozen times or so i give it a little gas and the oil light come on so I shut it off and check the dip stick but I still have a really hard time seeing where it is. This happens a few more times, rev, light, turn off and try to see oil level.

Then I get it going one more time rev and it goes totally nutz running at extremely high rpm it's not long before the oil and coolant is exploding out of the engine, oil shooting out of the exhaust and enough smoke to make it impossible to see for 15 ft behind the car.I pulled the key and detached the battery at a loss of what else to do.This goes on for maybe a full minute before it dies.

After my nerves calm down and a chat on the phone with a mechanic friend I drained the oil ( luckily hadn't all burnt out) which there was quite a bit of & manually cranked it to make sure it hadn't seized up.
I let it cool for a bit and added more oil and water. It started up again and runs but it does sound a tiny bit knockier and a couple of times when I gave it gas the oil light still comes on.
I know after all this some of you out there may want me to sign a contract saying i'll never lift the hood of another vw just to ensure they'll be safe from me but hopefully the rest of you may be able to lead me in the direction to right my wrongs and figuring out how repair any damages i may have made.
Thanks, Niko.

[coke]

I would've put it in gear and let the clutch out with the brakes on... hard. That would've stopped it. The engine ran away from having too much oil, and well, since they'll burn motor oil as a fuel, you get the idea.

[Intharbuddy]

I sure wish i had had time to think about doing that. I realized it was running on all that extra oil once i had a minute to see what the hell just happened. Now I'm just wondering what I most likely damaged from pulling such a bonehead move.

[82vdub]

It may be fine. Put a mechanical oil pressure gauge on the engine somewhere to determine if you have an oil pressure problem or wiring problem.

[the man 53]

Put a Mann filter on. If you have a Fram that is common for the oil light to do that.

[82vdub]

Why would an oil filter cause the oil light to flicker? Ole 82's had Fram's on it since I've owned it (270k miles) and likely all it's life (387k miles).

[Fatmobile]

Over 2000 RPM the dynamic oil pressure light comes on,.. if the sensor is bad or disconnected.
Could be what you see when you rev it.

Being able to shut it off with the key means it wasn't a runaway.
Oil pressure gauge is a great idea.

Really har dto believe you had old oil so clear you couldn't se eit on the stick,, that would confuse me too, ha.

[TylerDurden]

It was a runaway, but not typical...
A typical runaway continually feeds the combustion with oil pushed through blowby. In this case overfilling allowed intake of oil from crankcase & valve cover venting, until enough oil was consumed to starve the process (no blowby to continue the cycle).

The oil was clear because the head was recently redone.

Running an engine over redline for that long may have caused some damage. I would run a compression check, check the timing (the belt may have skipped) and install the oil-pressure gauge to verify the pressure is adequate at all typical rpms.

It may be fine, but I would put it on probation until it proves dependable.

[the man 53]

Because it happens with Fram all the time. You have been fortunate. I had the exact same problems once, then I changed the oil and it went away. I thought older oil/viscosity, but I changed it again miles later and it came back. On the other forum, many have had this issue and it was the Fram. It happens...

Why does it? Fram are crap filters. Made with cardboard and epoxy on the bottom to attach it to the filter media. The filter media they have is usually at least 20% less for all their filters compared to a Mann or Bosch, I cannot find our filter specifically but look here for another cars filter for reference http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilters/toyota.html . The bypass valves are cheap and poorly constructed as well as not having the same pressure bypass as the Mann...IIRC 6lbs less and this is the part that causes the light in our VW's. Fram is not a top shelf item and their QC isn't that great...that is why.

[82vdub]

I've read the report that someone did regarding the filter media used in various filters. I find it interesting that there is such a difference, and also find it interesting that if one manufacturers filters are terrible, that they remain in business. If their filters are truely terrible and people take legal action, a company would be forced to change how they make the filter to get themselves out of legal issues. That's the reason why I personally don't think there's much to concern myself over different filters and how they're made.

I do know that at various times, changing oil will resolve some issues. I've personally known this twice on a Nissan and Chevy that a lifter tick formed, and changing the oil removed the issue. However, was it the oil or was it the filter since both were changed? I still can't see how an oil filter that includes a bypass valve in it can cause the oil light to flicker. If it's flickering because the bypass valve in the filter is opening and closing, isn't that an indication that the oil pump moves too much oil and the oil is too thick, or that the filter is plugged and that the oil pump can't develop enough pressure, or that the bearings or something else are worn so bad that the engine can't hold proper oil pressures? Am I wrong on this?

On another note, I've had my oil light flicker on ole 82, but that was due to a faulty pressure switch on the filter flange, and (at a separate time) a bad connection on the wire that connects to said pressure switch.

[Dakotakid]

You are naive on several levels:

1) Class action lawsuits take a massive amount of money and effort to initiate.

2) Mk. II's use a different oil monitoring system than your older clunker.

3) Fram filters not only create the described problems (from time to time) they will also occasionally (upon startup) swell and burst the seam (making your landlord or ol' lady very happy with the randomized art work you have created on the driveway concrete!).

[82vdub]

I wouldn't necessarily agree with the nieve part, but I will say that I'm still not convinced that the filter causes the problem because it hasn't been explained what happens with one specific brand filter to cause the issue. I'm clearly not an expert, not a mechanic (except wrenching on my own and others stuff for 30+ years) and not quite completely knowlegable about VW oiling systems and filter bypass valves etc. But, for those stating that the oil filter causes the problems, please explain. I'm curious to know the theory behind why an oil filter can cause a flickering oil light.

I've heard of oil filters (not just Fram) swelling and bursting in extreme conditions. I'm also wise enough to know that there is no manufacturer out there that has 0% failure rate with their product. When it's cold out, Ole 82 pegs a 100PSI gauge, so it's not quite a low pressure that we're dealing with here.

[the man 53]

Well 82, you said you are no expert/mechanic and want proof why it is. I told you, the bypass isn't even set up to run at the same pressure as a Mann or Bosch. Sometimes the cardboard will separate and let most of the oil go unfiltered and not even engage the bypass on them. Frams spring is not a steel spring, but spring loaded plastic, which as I said above is the issue we have in our VW's is the bypass valve...it can go either way and let too much or not enough bypass. If it lets not enough bypass, it will clog the filter and will starve the engine for oil and have that light go off. Make sense yet? Also, I said that Fram's QC sucks and that it has happend to me and several others. I can dig up threads if you wish, but I doubt you would actually read or comprehend it if you aren't listening already.

With mine I didn't want to dump 5 quarts of oil that I just put in, so I did just spin a filter on and top it off. Amazingly, with most of the same oil, no more oil light.

I suggested this to the OP as it is a 8.00 fix and if it doesn't work out for him *if he even is running Fram* he won't hurt his engine one bit and it only cost him 8.00 and a few minutes. The effect would be noticed immediately and if it didn't work he could post back.

To add to Dakotakid's good post above, the reason fram isn't out of business is Walmart. The only reason I bought Fram for my VW back in the day was because they were the only filter I didn't have to special order. All my parts stores didn't carry the correct diesel filter. Walmart did only in Fram. Once you are in Wal Mart you establish a name that is hard to get rid of. Even when you are selling crap on a plate if there are people nieve enough to buy repeatedly without question, it will stay around a long long time. Plus, there is a ton of money in the Wal Mart deals.

[82vdub]

There, an answer to a question, and, a further explanation on what your idea of the problem with the filters was. Your explanation of changing only an oil filter and having the problem go away leads to the filter as being the problem. That hadn't been stated before, except that you said you changed the oil, but made no mention of a filter change, or a separate filter change leaving only oil. And, even though this has kind of gotten off topic, I do believe that it's best to keep the personal attacks and personal opinions on others off the forum, and I'll just leave it at that.

Intharbuddy - any update?

[Intharbuddy]

Alright. Thanks for all the help so far. I guess I may have a small glimmer of hope that all is not lost. I've never had the horrible experience of seeing an engine go nutz like that and was sure the damage would be extensive.
My plan is as follows: Change the oil and filter (where can find a mann or a bosch filter, online?), borrow a oil pressure guage (what should it read?), and have the timing and compression check.
Hopefully I'll have time in the next couple of days.
Thanks, Niko.