paraffin and other potions..

[DanHoug]

here's some recent observations on fuel potions i've been playing with.

- paraffin. tried a 1/4lb block in my veg oil tank just because it is heated and can swallow anything, solid or liquid. nice. it lowered my low speed nailing i get on veg oil pretty dramatically and gives a nice soft running. too cold here to throw it in the diesel tank.

- Amsoil Cetane Boost. i bought some of this because it is 100% 2-Ethylhexyl nitrate, a very popular cetane boost additive and i wanted to try it to tame some low speed nailing i get with veg oil. used at the suggested dose of 1oz/5 gal it really had no effect on nailing. used in the diesel tank, it helps somewhat but is not a miracle cure for the injector nozzles i have that are plugging up.

- Diesel Purge. MSDS says it is 60-100% naptha, 3-10% 2-Ethylhexyl nitrate, and a bit of benzene. this stuff works dramatically to clean injector nozzles very quickly. once cleaned, my nozzles are quiet in terms of nailing.

- naptha. whaddya know, this is what makes Diesel Purge work. buy it by the gallon at the hardware store for about $14 or buy a gallon of Coleman stove fuel for $9. tried the Coleman fuel mixed with some 2 stroke oil and it worked just like DP. add a bit of Amsoil Cetane boost and you've got Diesel Purge for cheap.

just another observation on India nozzles... since rebuilding my injectors about 10K miles ago with India nozzles, i swear i am getting deposits faster than my old OEM France nozzles. they clean off nice with Diesel Purge or naptha and then run quiet for about 3,000 miles and then start nailing hard again. i'm getting weary of this and will rebuild a set of injectors with some 193 Brazil nozzles i picked up. we'll see what happens.

-dan

[demon]

Thanks Dan for the input. Good to know. So far ive only been running Howes in every tank. Seems to work good for me, but id like to try the Stanadyne. I was gonna try out the DPurge. Thanks for the info!

[vanbcguy]

Very interesting!!

Have you been using naptha like diesel purge (ie running off a bottle of it) or have you just been soaking the injectors in it?

[DanHoug]

running it full strength with some lubricating oil mixed in. i'll probably mix it 10% oil, 5% Cetane Boost, and 85% naptha when i run out of DP.

i'd tried the naptha (actually used Coleman fuel) and veg oil initially because it is so darn easy with the aux veg tank. it worked fine at about a 60/40 mix naptha/veg.

-dan

[Fatmobile]

I'd be worried about putting some of those things in a heated tank,.. for fear of fumes.
Is your vegy tank heated?

[DanHoug]

yeah, i worried about that too! i figured the small amount left would boil off over time, and the rest would get used up as the tank was refueled and used.

i knew just adding veg oil to 'dilute' it wouldn't lessen the safety issue as the tank would essentially perform a fractional distillation and drive off the volatiles early, creating a very combustible gas. but the risk was known, i wasn't stupid around the tank, and i knew it would go away with time. but i just really wanted to try it that way!... "Hey. Watch this..."

-dan

[avocado]

running it full strength with some lubricating oil mixed in. i'll probably mix it 10% oil, 5% Cetane Boost, and 85% naptha when i run out of DP.

Dan,

How long do you run DP through it for?

I've got a "new to me" engine that I want to clean out, but I'm new to diesels and don't want to screw anything up - especially since it currently runs!

Cheers,
Avo

[DanHoug]

you use DP straight, no dilution. so take your intake fuel line off after the filter and also take off the return line so you can circulate the DP back into your container you are drawing it out of.

it doesn't hurt anything, so feel free to suck down a whole can. i like to put one of those $2 inline filters on the intake hose just to keep any grit out that may come out of the return line.

-dan

[Fatmobile]

I don't like putting the stock filter in the diesel purge loop either.
A cheap, clear plastic filter works great.

,.. long enough to use 2 cans

[DanHoug]

i should add Sea Foam to the potions list...

Pale Oil 40 - 60 %
Naphtha 25 - 35 %
IPA 10-20 %

IPA is Isopropyl alcohol, 90-100% but note anhydrous isopropyl (99%) is difficult to locate (electronic suppliers have it). their MSDS says 90% might be used, which is available at drug stores as 91%.

http://www.seafoamsales.com/component/o ... view,file/

notice the Naptha element again... powerful cleaner for fuel related deposits.

-dan

[hagar]

DanHoug and ALL : Paraffin is a miracle potion for VE pumps and Injectors. (there are many grades all works).

Are VE pumps lotions sensitive ? answer is yes , SO ? use caution.Remember BOSCH made the pumps for GERMAN Diesel # 2., that means all seals and O rings may not be OK in some solvents.. .I put some of the O rings in a glass of different solvents. O rings failed the potion test at hagars.. . When "Biodiesel" first were used , all heck broke loose . BOSCH repair stations worked overtime resealing pumps. It was decided that the best solution was to use "VITON" . , At this point I hope that avocado will help us out (he is chemically educated.).

Is Viton more costly ? yes. but IMHO worth every penny.

. hagar.

[avocado]

Are VE pumps lotions sensitive ? answer is yes , SO ? use caution.Remember BOSCH made the pumps for GERMAN Diesel # 2., that means all seals and O rings may not be OK in some solvents.. .I put some of the O rings in a glass of different solvents. O rings failed the potion test at hagars.. . When "Biodiesel" first were used , all heck broke loose . BOSCH repair stations worked overtime resealing pumps. It was decided that the best solution was to use "VITON" . , At this point I hope that avocado will help us out (he is chemically educated.).

Oddly enough, hagar, it appears that the issue with the injection pump seals is not necessarily a biodiesel issue but an issue with the aromatic content of the fuel, which is also a result of moving to ULSD. For ULSD, when they do additional processing (hydrotreating) on the diesel to reduce the sulfur content, the aromatic content also ends up getting reduced. Turns out that these aromatics helps some of the rubber types used in o-rings expand: not a lot, but just enough. I've read that this effect gets more pronounced for engines which are high mileage and/or have been frequently cycled to high temps and back (kinda sounds like an old VW diesel, right)?

There's some more info here:
http://www.chevron.com/products/prodser ... -leaks.pdf

They also mention that some of the new fuels can degrade faster, which results in possible by-products that can attack the seals as well (I hadn't heard about that).

To put this in the context of biodiesel: BD typically doesn't have any aromatic content, and therefore adding BD to dinosaur-derived-diesel (dino-diesel) further reduces the aromatic content of the fuel, exacerbating the seal issue. BD can also break down the seals, like it does the old fuel lines. I'm looking into that a bit more now.

FWIW, the hydrotreating step I mentioned above is essentially treating the fuel with hydrogen. This is done for two reasons: hydrogen reacts with sulfur in the fuel, forming H2S, which can be removed (nitrogen too, forming ammonia) and it breaks down carbon bonds to "saturate" the carbon chain: essentially this breaks down carbon rings, aromatics, and some branched carbon chains to form more carbon-hydrogen bonds instead of carbon-carbon bonds.

Here's some additional info on the history of hydrotreating:
http://processengineers.blogspot.com/20 ... ocess.html

[hagar]

--EH ?. ---and with that 15ppm stuff. ? --we have new problems. (we may have to use "VITON " seals)


hagar.

PS : I posted that in mar 2006.

[avocado]

here's some recent observations on fuel potions i've been playing with.

<snip>
- naptha. whaddya know, this is what makes Diesel Purge work. buy it by the gallon at the hardware store for about $14 or buy a gallon of Coleman stove fuel for $9. tried the Coleman fuel mixed with some 2 stroke oil and it worked just like DP. add a bit of Amsoil Cetane boost and you've got Diesel Purge for cheap.
</snip>

-dan

So I've got my injectors out and I'm wondering: think soaking them in naphtha (or any solvent - I've got some xylene I've been using to clean up some old 30-Pict 3 carbs I'm rebuilding) is going to be effective in cleaning them up/removing deposits?

I'm thinking "yes" and that it's easier than running DP or naphtha+two-cycle-oil through the hole injector system, but then again, the pressurized system and heat might also be necessary to give a good cleaning.

Thoughts?

[DanHoug]

well, it might work as a soak but far far better is to give the nozzles a good run in a heated, ultrasonic cleaner. unless there is damage, it completely rejuvenates the nozzle removing all carbon deposits. i use a water-based degreaser like Purple Power at 45C for 1/2 an hour or so. spotless when they come out.

just as a warning, never use a flammable agent in an ultrasonic cleaner as you'll get volatilization and boom.

-dan