Need some advice- coolant hose came off & 1.6 got really hot

[JRM]

Need some advice guys, I sold my 1985 VW golf that is also listed in the FS thread to a super nice couple thats also a forum member who lives 3 hours east of me. The car was my daily driver of 110 miles a day up until the water pump started makeing noise in 2008. I have driven it every month since and it fired right up and other than a musty smell from sitting ran exactly as it always had so I guarenteed it would make it without a problem
So, before they arrived I ran it into my fathers shop and gave it the twice over. checked everything includeing a good stream of coolant return in the pressure tank and no pressure in the tank when running so good to go.
It was a nasty moonless rainy night and they were headed over the cascades 6% grade... only about 15 miles into the trip the engine locked up- the lower U shaped rad hose that goes to the water pump poped off- there was no way to know the car lost its coolant in the dark rainy night (see failures below). It was so hot it was burning oil off the valve cover, it died on narrow sholderless section of a busy highway and there night turned much much worse...I got to the car about 15 minutes later and it was still super hot but the car had to be moved so I tried to start it, it turned over really easy almost like someone took out the glow plugs- After 20 seconds of cranking it fired rough and then smoothed right out and ran ok. I moved it up to a side road. I refuneded them there money as that was the right thing to do.
Why the hose poped off I dont know, maybe due to the radiator fan not working? I used a old stock spring clamp on the hose years back.
He had no idea it was running hot as:
1. Coolant temp guage wasnt workeing- and still doesnt-
2. No low coolant warning LED blinked- still not working
3. Radiator fan never came on- still doesnt work- must be connected to the same sensor as the dash guage

A few questions:
1. Is the lower end ok? Blowby is the same.
2. Why was the car compressionless when it was hot but normal after it cooled?
3. What normaly causes shutdown of car when it gets ultra hot? Pistions expanding or do the injectors stop firing as they expand internally?
Here is a video of how it runs now:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dw3RVFgjHKw

[texcl]

Wish I lived close to you I'd low ball the heck out of you and take it off your hands . Just kidding, lets just hope it's a simple head gasket issue and not a more serious issue like a cracked block. Bet it's a warped head or bad gasket. The gasket is pretty simple to change and you can check the head and block for warpage with a straight edge when it's off. My buddies caddy just did the same thing minus the blown hose, he thought it was a bad pump but the pressure in the coolant tank said otherwise. I wonder if you didn't blow the head gasket and have a bad coolant cap that didn't release the pressure and popped the hose off.

[JRM]

Gosh I hope it isnt a cracked block, hmm.. it was crazy hot- like engine blow at a hot rod show hot (and hot tar smell) Before They arrived I checked the tank for pressure as I know how common vw head gaskets are and no pressure. I also took the car on a 100 mile trip in early october week before last and everything was great- (but it was a cool crisp sunny day) It all seems to be the temp sensor causeing the fan, the tank sensor and guage to fail- are these both on the same circuit?

[Caerbannog]

I'll take a stab at your question #2: By getting super hot, you lost your clearance on your valves. One or more valves were lifted slightly off their seats all the time even when off the fat part of the cam lobe, so you had no compression.

This is a mechanical head, right? Your valve clearances may be on the low side, anyway.(Note to myself: Check valve clearances soon!)

[damac]

damnit this is a reminder to me to get some kind of gages and senders to warn at a settable coolant temp and oil pressure

no experience with whats wrong but i have seen my cars gages work most of the time, but then there are sessions where they are cursed until the car is shutoff? I got good and extra grounds going all over and it doesn't happen often but I could see this scenerio easily playing out on my car.

Sometimes I have seen the oil light continue to blink, the low coolant light even though its full and I have seen the coolant temp shootup within minutes of a cold start past 3/4 freaking me out.

So they cannot be trusted in my limited experience.

Wierd the other day this happened and now that I think about it after I stopped the car and popped the hood the radiator fan didn't come on either, when it typically always does for a minute or two on shutdown. So something being tied into it sensor wise, not sure, I need to get to the bottom of that one as well.


For those in the know just curious. Lets say you had a sender in relative port on the engine for the coolant temp and set it a bit above what you typically see. If im on the freeway and happened to lose a hose and coolant fast and heard the buzzer and was able to pull over and shut the car off within 30 seconds, is it going to be ok or will the block continue to overheat enough to warp things, etc.?

[JRM]

Caerbannog, that makes sence- i shimed them on the tight side to reduce noise (see actual photos). Yes it "was" a mechanical head.

[Fatmobile]

I had this happen to me.
I think a warped head is what stopped me,.. couldn't get it to start again so not exactly like yours.

[DanHoug]

first off, very cool for refunding the money so quickly and easily. it is what we all would want to happen to us and congratulations for doing the right thing.

the rad fan coolant sensor is mounted in the lower drivers side of the rad and is totally independent of the gauge circuit. i think that year sensor has 3 contacts with 12v supplied to one of them and the other 2 terminals go to the High speed circuit and one to Low speed. the low speed circuit goes thru a ceramic resistor mounted on the frame of the rad fan. high is direct and has enough amperage to burn out the rad fan sensor/switch with some regularity. some models ran everything thru a relay bank mounted on the rad fan frame. start diagnosing by pulling the plug off the back of the rad fan, ground the terminal the brown wire was attached to, and put 12v on the other terminals to test. work your way back from there.

i had a rad hose blow and while i stopped quickly, it did take out my head gasket in the process of sitting there hot without coolant. i can't open the Youtube video but if the engine runs fine, just change the scorched oil and try running it after fixing the fan circuit. in theory, all sorts of bad things happen when the engine overheats... temper goes out of the rings, head warps/cracks, pistons scuff, etc. but any damage is already done, if any, so just drive and see how bad it is.

-dan