1.6 NA into a Quantum TD

Methanolab · Post by **Methanolab** » Mon May 07, 2007 8:48 am

Hey, I know this is a backwards question. I have found info on putting a TD into NA cars but I want to rebuild my TD motor to put into a vanagon and keep the Quantum it came from on the road as my daily driver since it is already inspected and registered. So I have a good 1.6 NA plus its donor parts from a Jetta to go into it. Everything should bolt right up shouldn't it since the TD has more add-ons than the NA?
--Chris

libbybapa · Post by **libbybapa** » Mon May 07, 2007 9:22 am

You'll have to mess with the exhaust and intake plumbing a little, but that shouldn't hard. Is it going into an already diesel vanagon, or WBX?

Andrew

Methanolab · Post by **Methanolab** » Mon May 07, 2007 7:28 pm

Well the 1.6NA is going into the Quantum. I suppose that is the installation that I will need to tweek the intake and exhaust on.

I am expecting the van to be more much more work. I have an '82 aircooled vanagon that I got cause it was cheep the transmission is a plus but the body is a little rough. I guess ideally I would buy the transmission separate and find a 90+ van in real good shape to put it all into but I don't know if I want to spend the $$.

At this point, I guess I am wondering how long it ought to take and what kind of special tools I will need to swap the two 1.6's in the quantum so as to minimize potential downtime.
--Chris

libbybapa · Post by **libbybapa** » Mon May 07, 2007 9:39 pm

Is the '82 a Westy? If it's a gl 7-passenger, I certainly wouldn't bother. It would be totally false economy unless you REALLY WANT a 7-pass TD vanagon. If it's a Westy with a rough body, it's a toss-up whther or not it's worth it.

Yes, I realized that the 1.6 n/a motor was going into the quantum and the 1.6TD was going into the vanagon. Yes, the vanagon conversion will be a whole lot more work. The only good thing about the air-cooled with that conversion is the transmission. On the one hand, the air-cooled tranny has good gearing, but it is weak. The WBX vanagon transmissions are fine gearing if tall tires are put on the rear and are stronger. If the air-cooled transmission has not previously been rebuilt, then the 3-4 slider will fail.

If you are just swapping engines and not freshening anything up in the process and you are mechanically inclined and proficient, then if everything went fairly well, I would expect a day out, a day in, and probably another day to fuss with all the little things and the things that didn't goe exactly right. Lots of IF's.

Andrew

Methanolab · Post by **Methanolab** » Tue May 08, 2007 11:07 am

I think westys are disgustingly overrated. I had an '82 diesel westy in really good shape and it was cool but only for the novelty factor. I like the vanagons for the way they handle and drive. I like the fact that they are VWs and the motor in the back and the carying capacity. I like everything about them and I would rather fit a vanagon with new appliances than bother with a ticking time bomb propane tank and other old smelly junk from a westy. I almost never used the poptop anyway and it is all just extra weight to me. I want a good cheap versatile efficient work/play van. And I like the low maintenance, resiliance and economy of the diesel.
I think you are right that the air-cooled might not be worth messing with. I did notice that the transmission felt a little weak, I didn't know that the WBX transmissions were almost as good in the gearing.
Yea I am mechanically inclined and proficient but I have never done a compleate motor swap. Wish me luck right? Are their any particularly good threads or resources on motor swaps that you know of, particularly on the 1.6? Thanks,
--Chris

tawney · Post by **tawney** » Tue May 08, 2007 8:13 pm

Let us know how it goes with the NA into the Quantum. I've got the same project waiting for me, plus I want to change it from an automatic to a five speed, maybe. It's going to be a few months probably before I get to the Quantum project, though. I'm up to my elbows in a re-build for installation into a pickup. Still a ways to go on that one.

Good luck!

libbybapa · Post by **libbybapa** » Tue May 08, 2007 8:52 pm

I like the Westy just fine, but I was speaking more in regards to VALUE, as in RESALE VALUE. Granted you may feel that you want a specific vehicle and that you are going to want it forever, but that is very, very rarely the case. You can put the work of a TD engine conversion into a rough bodied air-cooled 7-passenger and you might LOVE it, but if you ever do decide to sell, you will be LUCKY to sell the car for $2500. That is basically the cost of the engine and conversion parts (diesel and water-cooling). Or you could get a straight bodied water-cooled westy with bad engine for $1,500-$2,000. After doing the same amount of work you would end up with a vehicle that will currently sell for $10,000-$12,000. More importantly the resale value of the westy has continued to climb whereas the resale value of the 7-passenger has continued to decline. That's the facts. You may feel the westies are overrated and you might want to put more work into a different setup, but you should be darn sure you want it forever cause you won't ever get your money out of it and you certainly won't get paid for your time. If however, you start with a decent westy base you will actually get paid well for your time. Good luck with the project.

Andrew

Methanolab · Post by **Methanolab** » Wed May 09, 2007 5:48 am

Post by **Fatmobile** » Thu May 10, 2007 11:38 pm

Hey Andrew, My buddy picked up an '82,... I think it's a vanagon, it's not set up for camping but I don't know my VW vans by name.
It was never air cooled, it came with a diesel engine.
Is that the kind of VW van you are saying has a low resale value?

libbybapa · Post by **libbybapa** » Fri May 11, 2007 12:57 am

There were quite a few different vanagon models. The two most common were the 7-passenger (standard van, hardtop, two bench seats and two front ones) and the Westy (short for Wesfalia, the camper conversion company). The Westy was the only factory authorized camper conversion. Westfalia worked with VW to produce campers from the 60s (possibly earlier) through the end of the 90s (with a few eurovan models). The later Eurovan campers were actually a collaboration with Winnebago. The 7-passenger vanagon has a comparatively low resale value when compared to the Westy. The explanation is simple. The 7-passenger vanagon is in direct competition with lots of other passenger minivans and quite frankly it fails against most with regard to reliability, functionality, economy, power, etc. The Westy on the other hand is a very compact, highly functional everyday passenger vehicle that couples as a small rv with the amenities of a sink, stove, refrigerator that runs on 120v, 12v or propane. The top pops up for good stand-up room and "upstairs pulls out to be a double bed. The rear bench seat folds down into a second double bed. The front seats both swivel around making for a large central area, and have a pull-up table that can be set between them. The rear bench seat has another swivel out table that can be used. With it's low-cost compared to other small RVs, it's ergonomics and amenities coupled with the small outside footprint (wheelbase and footprint the size of a jetta) the VW Wesfalia campmobile is in a class all it's own with no other competitors.

I recently saw a stock non-turbo diesel westy sell for over $12,000 on eBay. I haven't seen a turbo'd 7-passenger one sell for more than $4,000. GoWesty recently sold a gas syncro westy for over $88,000 USD.

Nice late-model syncro westies are routinely selling for $20,000+ and nice late model 2WD ones are routinely selling for $15,000+. The value of the Westy has climbed remarkably quickly in the last few years.

Andrew

Andrew