Rabbit over heat and no longer runs

[tummyacid]

Please tell me I am not a murderer. I have a 1981 Rabbit diesel. A week ago while driving up a hill I noticed the heat stopped blowing hot. Concerned I started looking for a place to pull over. As I was shifting, I could feel the engine cut out and I coasted to a very dark stretch of highway where I called a tow truck. I ran to the front to pop the hood and it smelled like a burned up alternator but I cannot be sure. There was smoke.

The interior lights haven't worked since I bought the car so I was unable to read any gauges. Got the car towed home and found the water system was bone dry. Charged the battery and still no starting, but she does crank.

I have been unable to work on the car since I had to return to school but hope to make a trip soon to try to determine if I warped the head or something equally disastrous. I was hoping to ask for any tips on assessing the damage from you folks, and maybe a little sympathy as I am quite bummed.

[82vdub]

You may have worped a head and damaged the head gasket. The block and head could also be cracked. If you get the car started (after you put coolant in the coolant system), immediately (in about 30 seconds) check for pressure in the coolant jug. If pressure is there, there's combustion gasses getting into the coolant. A compression test will tell you if the compression is good or not.

[davidpa28140]

Well at least the pistons did not sieze... I would figure the head will need replaced at a minimum(that coolant went somewhere) but like 82vdub said, a compression check is in order. Sorry to hear about the incident.

[vanbcguy]

How does it sound when it's cranking? Does it sound like it's turning over the same as it did before the event, or is it cranking over faster?

[Quantum TD]

If you do need to redo the head, be sure to read up on the 11mm headbolt issue. You probably have a 1.6na with the 11mm head bolts. It's not the end of the world, you'll just need to use head studs, which add another $100-130 to your total rebuild cost. But they are reusable, unlike the stock ones (well, technically you can reuse the stock ones, but they'll crack your block).

If you can't get it to fire off, try some WD-40 into the intake. It's easier on the engine than ether. If it does fire, but only with accelerant, then it's probably got a cooked head. Maybe rings too.

[rabbit_man]

Back when I was a new rabbit owner I did a foolish thing, I added coolant and forgot to put the cap back on.

Then I went on a 15-20 mile drive, it lasted about 12 miles and luckly it was winter so the heater was running. When the heater quit heating I got out put the cap back on and DROVE to a friends house about a 1/2 mile......huh, that reminds me, he wasn't home and I forgot to tell him so I guess I owe him some coolant .

Anyways it's still fine so hopefully your "experience" is similar. The problem is your's probably over heated first and then ate the coolant (very hard on stuff ) rather than lose the coolant first........

[tummyacid]

I am feeling a little better. I had JUST had the pump rebuilt...

Ya my cousin said he added coolant and was unable to determine where it went so Id agree it is leaking into someplace it should not.

He also mentioned that it sounds like the compression is much less then it used to be when he tries to start it.

Thanks again for the tips I am going to try to take a look at it today if I can get a lift. The motor had been rebuilt earlier, if as you said the piston have not seized, then what are the chances I could even get this thing running again? What do you guys imagine the parts could cost (ballpark)? Ive got until I graduate this Spring to have a car running.

[rabbit_man]

If you can tell the compression is lower then just yank the head, it could be warped/cracked, same with the block. How bad it is determines if it can be machined back into specs.

Also the rings could've lost their spring and no longer seal.

The HG probably leaks too.........

[tummyacid]

good news, my cousin said he got it started!

he also located a missing hose to the coolant system, says the thing is completely missing. That explains the disappearing coolant (I hope)

I have a collection of VW hoses and just happen to have a replacement for it so I will go tomorrow and hopefully drive her home if she goes after getting up to temp.

I will test the compression of the coolant like you suggested and I would like to get a compression test if the cost is reasonable.

Thank you all again for your replies I will be sure to follow up with the results of tomorrow.

[82vdub]

The mising hose could have caused the coolant loss, or an over pressurized cooling system could have caused the hose to disapear. In any case, investigate for block/head/head gasket damage before assuming everything is fine after dumping coolant into the system.

[tummyacid]

horray the bunny survived the trip back!

turns out one of the coolant hoses ruptured and dropped all the coolant onto the road. Soon thereafter the engine overheated and cut out.

After we replaced all the remaining hoses under the hood (I mean it, ALL of them) and filled the system again it seemed to run well.

The only thing that worries me is there appears to be some sort of vapor coming out of the coolant return line inside the jug. The only odor I detect is antifreeze. It appears within a minute after starting. Soon pressure builds enough that I have to put the cap on the jug. I am worried this may be combustion gases exiting via the coolant system.

Tomorrow I hope to get the compression test. As I understand, the leak down test is the one I need. Otherwise the bunny seems to be operating just as before the incident. Makes me wonder if the problem has existed a while.

In the final analysis, I would have to say the lesson is anytime you have a leaking IP, you should take the time to replace ALL the hoses that may have diesel drips on them.

Thanks all who replied to this thread!

[Quantum-man]

good news, my cousin said he got it started!

he also located a missing hose to the coolant system, says the thing is completely missing. That explains the disappearing coolant (I hope)
I have a collection of VW hoses and just happen to have a replacement for it so I will go tomorrow and hopefully drive her home if she goes after getting up to temp.

I will test the compression of the coolant like you suggested and I would like to get a compression test if the cost is reasonable.

Thank you all again for your replies I will be sure to follow up with the results of tomorrow.

Mr Acid, can you explain further, the above profound statement? You can't just run a coolling system without a hose. I can't think of one that could be blocked off without impeding flow of coolant such to adversely affect cooling. Why does that explain coolant loss

[tummyacid]

alright the best explaination that I can come up with is the leaking pump got diesel on the really short hose that comes out of the water pump That was the initial source of the failure as I imagine.

At some point (invariably after completely filling up the tank) the hose burst and dumped all the coolant onto the road. I said "I hope" because I was afraid the coolant went into the engine, which I am satisified it did not because the oil remains non-milky.

Oh I think I see what you mean. We were concerned I had damaged the engine to such an extent that it would not start or even diesel. So he got the engine to turn over a few time on its own and shut it off. Then we replaced the hoses and coolant, then started it again this time to operating temp.

[82vdub]

Glad you got it started. The hoses that get diesel on them will soften and often rupture leading to what you experienced. Unfortunately, the "vapor" you have coming into your coolant jug is probably combustion gasses, so your motor needs more attention and likely a head gasket swap - at a minimum. You can determine compression with just a standard compression tester. You would test each cylinder individually and find out what the compression numbers for each cylinder are. I've never used a leak down tester in all my engine work (but I'm not a mechanic). Just make sure you get a diesel compression test gauge setup, not gas, and that you get - or make up - fittings that fit the VW diesel engine.

[tummyacid]

thats for the info there is a diesel shop right down the road from my house with a bunch of VW guys that work there and know these cars in and our. I am going to go by there today and ask if they can do a compression test for me and how much they would charge to do the head gasket. I wouldn't mind attempting the work myself but where I live there is no place to work on the car.

Obviously this must be addressed but the performance of the car seems relatively the same. Just wondering if this is the kind of thing I can still drive a couple miles to the grocery store with or should I take it directly to the shop and beg for mercy?

Thank you again for taking the time to read this thread